Well, Prime Minister, Anthony Albanese, is this morning at the centre of a fresh housing debate, refusing to rule out changes to negative gearing and capital gains tax. For more, we're joined by the Prime Minister himself, live from Kirribilli in Sydney. Good morning to you, PM. All right, this is your chance to clear things up. Are you going to curb negative gearing and capital gains tax deductions or not?
ANTHONY ALBANESE, PRIME MINISTER: No, we have no plans. What our plans, are out there, are about supply. And my concern with the proposals that have been put forward from time to time about negative gearing is that they won't have a positive impact on supply. We need more homes. That's why we have our $32 billion Homes for Australia plan, some of which has been blocked in the Senate. We want the Liberals, the Nationals and the Greens, this new No-alition, to get out of the way and vote for our plans for Help to Buy, which is about more people buying homes, which will increase supply, and our Build to Rent scheme - that's about incentives for the private sector to build more private rentals. We also have, of course, our investments in public housing. So, we want more people in public housing, we want more private rentals and we want more people in home ownership. That's our $32 billion Homes for Australia plan.
ABO: All right, we've heard the pitch, PM. And it's a pitch that we have heard before and that No-alition that you refer to will keep saying no, but right now is negative gearing, are you going to touch it or not before the next election? Is it changing?
PRIME MINISTER: No, we have no plans to change negative gearing, Sarah. What we have a plan to do is to do that, and we're also concentrating on, just this week, we had yesterday, of course, the figures on inflation that was so important. That's been our concentration, that's been our main game. And that drop from 3.5 to 2.7 is so important because it's been delivered at the same time as we're delivering living cost of living relief. That has been our focus.
ABO: But, you know, and as economists have told us as well, that that 2.7 per cent rate is really just mirroring the rebates, the energy rebate that's out there, and actually the inflation rate's 3.5 per cent. Michelle Bullock hasn't moved the rates, the interest rates, because of that.
PRIME MINISTER: That's not right. Sarah. With respect, every single one of the inflation figures, whether it be the excluding volatile, is down from 3.7 to 3. Trim means down from 3.8 to 3.4, and the headline figures down from 3.5 to 2.7. Every one of the figures that were released yesterday is heading in the right direction. And that's a good thing.
ABO: So, why hasn't the Reserve Bank Governor moved then? Is she wrong?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, the Reserve Bank moved that they had their meeting, of course, before these figures came out. What our job has been is to get that downward pressure on inflation at the same time as we've delivered on cost of living relief, including the energy bill relief. We think that's a good thing, that that's put downward pressure on inflation. But at the same time as well, tax cuts for every taxpayer, Fee-Free TAFE, cheaper child care - all of these measures making a difference for people at the same time as wages are increasing, because we want people to earn more and to keep more of what they earn.
ABO: You know those tax cuts you mentioned there, the last time we spoke about tax cuts, you said that nothing was going to change. Then you asked Treasury to look at it and then it changed. And that was a broken promise. It sounds very similar to what we're hearing at the moment with negative gearing. You say it's not going to change, yet Treasury is looking at it. There could be a change, right? Which could mean another broken promise to the Australian public.
PRIME MINISTER: That's not right. I tell you what, Sarah, see if you can find someone who says that what we did on income tax was the wrong thing. I know there was some controversy when we did it, but it was the right thing done for the right reasons. That was a courageous decision.
ABO: You said you weren't going to change it and then you changed it. That's the point. It's about transparency with the Australian public who deserves to know.
PRIME MINISTER: What it was about, Sarah, was making sure that every single taxpayer got tax relief. And previously that wasn't the case. And we did the right thing because of the economic circumstances which were there, of people needing that cost of living relief. So, we made the right decision for all the right reasons. And it's had a real difference for people. If you pay people more and you lower their taxes, then they're better off. And that is simply what we have been determined to deliver. And at the same time, do it in a way which has seen inflation halve on our watch, about a third of where it peaked. Now, that is a performance which is an indication of the success of our economic management. This is about getting those economic settings right.
ABO: I guess that means then it is sometimes worthwhile to take issues to Treasury to look at. Again, I'm just curious. This policy on negative gearing has been taken to Treasury. You guys took it to the election in 2016 and in 2019 and lost.
PRIME MINISTER: Well, it hasn't been taken to Treasury. What we have is that I've encouraged the public service to actually do their job, which is if the public service looks at ideas and kicks ideas around, that's a matter for them. But it's governments that make decisions. And my Government, when it comes to housing, the decision that we're making is all focused on supply, where also when it comes to cost of living, we are taking action on supermarkets.
ABO: What I am hearing there, PM, you did ask the public service to look at it, is that right? Just to confirm what you just said?
PRIME MINISTER: No.
ABO: It's what you said.
PRIME MINISTER: No, you're not hearing that at all. I explicitly said I didn't. The public service don't have to be told, I'm not their school teacher who sets tasks. What I want is a public service that's dynamic, a public service that does its job in the best traditions of the public service. But a government makes decisions. And what we've done is this week as well, the announcement by the ACCC that they're taking legal action against the supermarkets is the first time that's happened such strong action, over 500 products in which the allegations are. They were upping their prices by $1.50, decreasing it by 50 cents and pretending that things were cheaper. Now, that's not fair, dinkum. That's ripping people off.
ABO: And it's a good thing to look at.
PRIME MINISTER: That's why they're taking them to court. Well, we're taking action.
ABO: And it's welcome action. Thank you so much for joining us.
PRIME MINISTER: We're just getting going, Sarah.
ABO: I know we are. I didn't even get to ask you what your tip is for the Grand Final, but we'll get to that another day, I'm sure.
PRIME MINISTER: Thank you. I'm here in Sydney, so of course my tip is the Swans.
ABO: Okay. There we go. An answer. Thanks, PM.
