UN Watch’s Legal Advisor Dina Rovner appeared on Chai FM with Howard Feldman to discuss recent delegitimization campaigns against Israel at the U.N., and the U.N.’s dangerous policy of treating Israel like a pariah state.
Howard Feldman: According to Professor Anne Bayefsky, President of Human Rights Voices and Director of the Touro Institute on Human Rights and Holocaust, the stage has now been set for a full-fledged effort by the United Nations to destroy the Jewish state by means of the first ever wholly Palestinian-drafted resolution. It is scheduled for adoption at an emergency session of the General Assembly on September 17th and 18th, 2024. And we wanted to understand a little bit more how was the Palestinian Authority allowed to submit such a resolution? What is the resolution and why is it problematic? We are joined this morning by Dina Rovner She is the legal adviser for UN Watch. Dina, very good morning. Thank you for joining us. How are you doing today?
Dina Rovner: Great. Thank you so much for having me.
Howard Feldman: A great pleasure. What is this resolution? Let’s start there.
Dina Rovner: Well, first of all, I think it’s important to put this all in perspective, because we shouldn’t look at this resolution as a one off. It’s part of a coordinated campaign against Israel’s legitimacy and even against its very existence. In the last few years, the Palestinians have really stepped up their delegitimization campaigns against Israel at the U.N. And that’s, of course, what their main goal was when they got non-member observer status in 2012.
And now what we see in this resolution is they’re trying to get Israel deemed a pariah state and expelled from the U.N., just like apartheid South Africa was. So on May 10th, four months ago, the U.N. gave the Palestinians a gift, a reward for terrorism after the Hamas October 7th atrocities. And what the U.N. did then was that it upgraded their non-member observer status at the U.N. to allow them to be more active, to sit with member states, and to introduce resolutions, among other things. And that’s a unique status that only the Palestinians have.
So now, based on that status, they have introduced this resolution demanding that Israel end its occupation and withdraw from the territories within six months. They put a timeline on it. And the resolution also accuses Israel of apartheid. And what’s important to know, what I really want to emphasize, is that General Assembly resolutions are not legally binding. They are political declarations. But even so, they can still be very damaging.
Howard Feldman: And in fact, we’ve seen that because we see that with the International Court of Justice, we see many of these resolutions and these items being passed. And in a way, I feel like we make ourselves feel better by saying they’re non-binding, but in fact, all they’re doing is moving the status closer to being one of moving toward delegitimizing Israel.
Dina Rovner: Yeah. And I think it’s really interesting that you mentioned that International Court of Justice advisory opinion because that’s exactly what happened. In 2022, we saw that the General Assembly adopted a resolution requesting an advisory opinion from the International Court of Justice basically on the legality of Israel’s occupation. And then just now, a couple months ago, on July 19, the International Court of Justice issued the advisory opinion. They said occupation is unlawful. They said Israel has to end the occupation as rapidly as possible. They accused Israel. They said Israel was engaging in systematic discrimination. And of course, we know that really means that they are accusing Israel of apartheid.
And so true, the advisory opinion itself is not legally binding, but we see where it’s headed. And it all started with this General Assembly resolution. And now we have this new Palestinian-sponsored U.N. resolution. It’s kind of the culmination of this whole delegitimization campaign. And the fear is, and I’ll tell you, it’s a very real fear that it could affect Israel’s security, because, like you said, even though the resolution itself isn’t binding legally, but it could put pressure. It could get other countries to continue pressuring Israel. We could see more arms embargoes, more kind of BDS types of activities, and just continuing this policy and practice at the U.N. of treating Israel like a pariah state, denying Israel security and at the same time giving a free pass to Palestinian terrorism.
Howard Feldman: So, what can be done to stop this resolution and reverse this trend?
Dina Rovner: Well, you know, I can’t say exactly how we can stop this resolution, but I think at this stage of the game, diplomacy at the diplomatic level is what’s really most important here. We want to see Israel’s allies standing up for Israel standing up against these kind of actions at the U.N. speaking out strongly and, you know, demanding accountability, really for the U.N., to demand accountability from Hamas. We want to see, you know, allies like the United States, Canada, European countries, the U.K., getting up and standing up against this resolution. And, you know, I hope that. The resolution is in the works. You know, that it’s supposed to be voted on next week. It’s still a draft. Maybe there could be some changes. Maybe it could even be withdrawn. It’s hard to know what will happen in the end.
Howard Feldman: Is Israel itself doing enough in this area of lawfare to fight and to perhaps change the trajectory?
Dina Rovner: Yeah, I mean, I think that that’s an important question. Is Israel doing enough? I’m working for UN Watch. I’m representing UN Watch. We’re a non-governmental organization, so we’re not connected at all with the government of Israel. And I think the government of Israel does have some constraints, like, for example, you know, they don’t want to participate in these international legal proceedings, for example, at the International Court of Justice, the advisory opinion or the International Criminal Court. These arrest warrants where Israel is being effectively, you know, treated as a pariah state, given discriminate, treated discriminant in a discriminatory manner compared to, you know, treated differently from other countries.
And we have to remind ourselves that Israel is, at the end of the day, Israel is a democracy. No other democracy is treated this way in the international arena. And so I understand Israel not wanting to participate in those proceedings, and I understand that, you know, the outcome of those proceedings are kind of predetermined. So whether or not Israel participates, the outcome would, probably, probably wouldn’t help in any way. But in terms of hasbara, you know, in terms of getting its message out there, I think Israel could be doing a better job.
Howard Feldman: That is where we leave it. Dina Rovner, legal adviser for UN Watch bringing us up to speed and explaining to us what this is all about and why this is dangerous.
